Rosa Gonzalez Obituary

Published by Legacy Remembers on Sep. 29, 2001.

'Take Care of My Daughter'

After the attack, when Rosa Julia Gonzalez telephoned her sister Migdalia from the offices of the Port Authority of New York and New Jersey on the 66th floor of 2 World Trade Center, these were her last words: ''I love you,'' she said. And then: ''Promise to me that you are going to take care of my daughter.'' That is because to Rosa, 32, a single mother who worked as a secretary, her 12-year- old Jennifer was everything. Certainly, Migdalia tried to reassure Rosa. But she was never sure her words had registered. The call was cut off. Only a little while later -- 10, maybe 15 minutes -- the building collapsed. ''Of course, Migdalia will take care of Jennifer,'' said Rosa's older sister Maria. ''We will all take care of Jennifer.'' The ''we'' refers to the six Gonzalez sisters who are not missing. Every day they and the rest of the family have been gathering in Jersey City, where Rosa lived. ''The situation is,'' Maria said, ''we have to be strong for Jennifer.'

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Not sure what to say?

September 10, 2023

Friend

Domingo Rivera

Rest in peace I will never forget you.

September 9, 2023

Daughter

Jenn Hernandez

Hey mom still missing you everyday 22yrs later and we never forget. Things are going well with me I'm still working in the hospital keeping busy. Iv finally accepted God in my life and its wonderful, I know what ever comes my way I'm never alone and he has helped me with my sadness he is my lord and savior. Iv made some great friends at the church I attend and its been great. Titi Mag and your sisters are doing good as well, and grandma sure keeps Titi Mag busy we just try to enjoy the days we have with her. I'm a proud bunny mama I have two Motita and Leon, Ms Motita sure keeps me busy she's a bit of a trouble maker she is definitely my sour patch kid lol and Leon is my little sweet fluff ball. Wish you were here for all my joys in my life and my downs. Love you always mom continue being my angel

September 11, 2021

Friend

Natalie

I spend the last weekend with Rosa before the horrible Tuesday. It was a Saturday, we went dancing. She loved to go out dancing. I remember like it was yesterday. We had a blast and was happy. We went to Sand Bar in Jersey City, Funny after dancing all night we took a break and went outside and we were looking at the WTC. We talk about her boyfriend, girl stuff and her daughter. Every time she talk about en her face would light up and smile. She Love her daughter with every inch in her soul. Finally, I want to say that God did not take Rosa, God did not wanted her to suffer and simple said, let her come to me. She is in a place where no evil can ever hurt her, a place with God, Angels and peace....

August 30, 2021

Daughter

Jennifer Hernandez

Cant believe its been 20 yrs already time sure fly's feels like it was yesterday when you kissed me goodbye before heading to work. I miss you every day, the family is doing well even with the world being crazy this past yr. Titi mag is great as always you would be so proud of how great of a mother she has been to me god has blessed me with two of best and most beautiful mothers a person can have. Grandma moved in with titi mag keeping her on her toes trying to enjoy the good moments with her. Iv been keeping busy as always at the hospital meeting lots of new great people at work. You will never be forgotten I love you with all my heart and one day we will be reunited until then continue being my angel

September 20, 2018

Shaii M

He heals the brokenhearted & binds up their wounds.
~Psalms 147~

Descanse En Paz.(Rest in Peace)i do not know ROSA....

Pero , i had much familia en jersey city, nj a long time, and i know they all mention to me years ago about you were a victim on 9/11, and had a small child pre-teen child age 12 i think at the time."

You're still livin' daily through, tu familia, through each happy memory that makes your loved ones smile with such a beautiful moments & living through such loved ones each passing day through such happy rememberance,that they have been blessed to share with you...i pray for your beloved now grown-up daughter, and tu familia, y' amiga's, todo quien,ALL WHO MISS YOU AND LOVE YOU, chica." God bless all victimas en 9/11, y' ROSA continue rip ahora." rip.

September 22, 2017

Cindy

September 11, 2015

Cindy Senatore (Papp)

14 years have passed my friend but it seems like yesterday. Jenn is such a beautiful young woman but I know you know this already and I know you are so proud of her. Please give my mom a hug in Heaven from me..xoxoxo

September 11, 2014

Cindy Papp

Miss you my friend, heaven has a beautiful angel. Jenn is such a wonderful young woman, I'm sure you are so proud of her. If you see my mom there please give her a hug from me. xoxoxo

May 15, 2014

domingo rivera

Dear Rosa
I remember when I bused to work you would ALWAYS walk by and I say hello to you. I thought you was so beautiful and I so wanted to ask you out for dinner. One day you had on a Asia dress on and I thought wow youre so cute and couldn't wait to talk more to you. Then I stopped seeing you. I wondered where you was . I fiqured you move and I was sad. Then the wtc happened. after work I saw pictures of you all over central ave. Then the papers.
I realize you was gone and I cried a lot. I walked over to your house in mahantta ave to lay flowers on your doorstep. Today I thought of you because of the wtc museum opening up.
And I looked for you and found this site.
I miss seeing you around a lot and hope you're at peace along with your family.
Rest in peace Rosa.

Domingo

September 11, 2013

You are remembered today, your life celebrated. May The Lord Jesus bless your family and loved ones with continued comfort, peace and joy. We will never forget.

September 11, 2013

Nico

Thinking of you today and often. Never forgotten!

September 10, 2013

Dorquis Diaz

It's been a while, I only one memory that i treasure for life. we were in our junior year in high school and you walked in with you hot red lip stick, your face glowing even though you were being tested and your heart was in pain. beside you that morning was your sister maggy and you pulled out two gold chains and them both had half a heart that said friends for ever and you told me Dolkis you are my best friend and i bought these chain so that we can always be together. so maggy got mad and stated that even if she was your sister she was still your best friend, so i answered her by given her my half of your friendship heart and stated is the same that you have it , its like i had it because we are not only frieds but also sisters. so, 10 years tommorow after this mayor catastrophy with the world trade center. weeks after your body was found my son allen went to see a movie in newport mall and he called me asking for me to come down he would not move from a foto booth in the mall cause your picture was there and he wanted for me to buy it he not enough money so i drove down to meet up with him and there you where a picture with half of your heart thank you . i love you and miss you so much. your memory will live in me til i meet up with you in heaven.

Posted by Dorquis Diaz

September 9, 2013

Cindy Papp

I know you are looking over us and you see what a wonderful young lady Jenn has become. She truly is a beautiful woman inside and out. I had the honor of being with your family for her College Graduation. I know you where there and feeling proud as well. I just know she has wonderful things ahead of her Rosa. We all Miss you very much, but no one more then Jenn...xoxo

September 11, 2012

may murray

we will never forget!!! thoughts, prayers...you will always live in the hearts of those you touched and the memories you have given us. you would be so proud of Jenn she has grown into a wonderful young woman...

September 10, 2012

Cindy Papp

Always in my prayers. Continue to look over us beautiful lady.

September 24, 2011

Stella C

Saw a documentary about your old friend Genelle, to Rosas Family, Rosa will never be forgotten her memory will live always in so many hearts of people in this world God Bless you Rosa

September 17, 2011

Tracey

Ive been thinking about you Rosa and praying for your family for many days. I know you are so proud of your beautiful daughter. Just know you will never be forgotten & your memory lives on forever. God Bless your Family

September 14, 2011

Cindy Papp

Rosa, 10 years have gone by so fast, it feels like yesterday we were on the path train together. I know you are so proud of your Jenn, she is such a lovely woman now. Miss you my friend xoxo.

September 13, 2011

Mayra Murray

Jule
You are loved n dearly missed...

September 11, 2011

Rodolfo Perez

I do miss seeing you around the avenue. We met once in person because your sister lived next door. I admired you cause you were a decent and proud mom besides being gorgeous. God took you home too soon.

September 3, 2011

Hi jule I love and miss u everyday. our family is doing ok but we will never forget the members that are missing. I know u are watching us from heaven titi I miss u we all do.

September 7, 2010

Cindy Papp

Hello my dear friend,

Its been nine long years, It seems like yesterday we were on the path headed to the WTC to start our day. I remember how excited you were about this job and how you were loving it. And how you planned to build a better future for you and Jen. My heart breaks everyday but more so during this time. I know you are looking down at all of us and watching over us. Jen is such a beautiful woman, you are proud I'm sure.

Rosa, We all love you and miss you everyday.

Love & Friendship always
Cindy

September 4, 2010

Deirdre Healey

To the family of Rosa,

In less than two weeks, we mourn the ninth year of the most tragic day our country has ever known. But, I know you mourn the ninth year without your sister, daughter and mother.

My name is Deirdre. In 2001, I lived in the same apartment building as your family, on Manhattan Avenue in Jersey City. I lived with my father, Ken, on the first floor. It was either the following day or two... that Rosa's brother, knocked on our door.

He had heard from our neighbor in the next apartment, that my father & I had a computer. Channel 2 news was telling it's viewers that they had put up a website, of victims names and where they had been taken for treatment. He asked me at the door, if I would please check this site.... for Rosa's name. Of course, I did.

I was relieved when I did find her name on the site... and I wrote down the information provided... and I ran up to Rosa's apartment, where you were all were... praying for her safe return. The information the website had provided, was that Rosa was at Jamacia Hospital in Queens.

Your family asked me to call the hospital... as you were all very distraught, of course. I didn't hesitate and told you that I would. I called and sat with you all... awaiting the hopeful news... that Rosa was alive and safe at the hospital.

When someone finally returned to me on the phone and spoke... my heart sank. I hung up... and had to look at your eyes... and say something that, to this day... is one of the hardest things I ever had to say.

The Rosa Gonsalez who was taken to Jamacia Hospital in Queens, was an EMT who was treated and released. It was not your Rosa.

I just found this site today. But for the last nine years.. I have carried with me, a sadness.. that for a moment I gave you a glimmer of hope. That I came to you with that information, thinking for sure, that she was alive. I have often wondered... if I had done something different.. that possibly, I could have spared you any additional pain. I can only imagine, how for a brief 15-20 minutes, you thought you might have her home.

For this... I am sorry.

In January of this year, my father, who lived in apartment #3 died. I spent the following month in his apartment before moving his belongings out. I spent time thinking of he and I in that apartment on the morning of Septmeber 11th.. and how we both prayed very hard for your mother, sister and daughter. My sister was also in the WWC on that morning. We were blessed to have her come home. My heart goes out to you, that Rosa did not.

I will never forget Rosa, or your family in my prayers. God Bless and keep you all.

Deirdre Kathleen Healey

August 10, 2010

I found out about this lady reading an article about one of her co-workers back in 2002..its 2010 now but 9/11 still isnt too far from my mind..im from bklyn and i remember everything that happened that day from the shock to sadness to the events later on hitting home when i found out that my girlfriend of the time had actually lost her mom in the towers..long story short God bless you Ms. Gonzalez and your family, friends, and your daughter..

-Lou
Bklyn,NY

September 11, 2009

Nancy Del Valle

Thinking of you my dear friend.

September 11, 2009

D Vargas

God Keep you Safe in Heaven Rosa.
You are remembered.

September 11, 2009

Cindy Papp

I know you are looking down at us from you special place in Heaven. God bless you my friend.

July 12, 2009

Craig Nagy

I was sent to NYC just after Thanksgiving of 2001 by the American Red Cross. My first assignment in the city was to Family Assistance Center at Pier 94. Along the entrance was a temporary wall that held the posters of the missing.

I never really purposely focused in on any particular poster, but there was one that would always seem to grab my attention. It seemed like the person on this poster was looking directly at me. In so many ways, she resembled my wife.

Finally, after a day or two, I stopped to read the poster of the beautiful woman who looked so much like my wife. Her name was Rosa J. Gonzalez, aged 32, and a single mother. At the moment that I read Rosa’s poster, those events that occurred on that day became much more personal to me.

God Bless You, your daughter, and your family.

September 11, 2008

Cindy Papp

God bless you and keep you this 7th anniversary in heaven.

September 12, 2007

Cindy

As always you are in my prayers. Jen has grown to be such a lovely lady. You would be so proud.

September 10, 2007

Doug Abraham

Happy Birthday!!!

March 12, 2007

D Vargas

Over the weekend I was informed that Rosa passed away on 9/11.
Not only was I shocked, but I couldn't believe it.

When I came into work this morning, I went online & searched for her name.
And sure enough, there was her picture...exactly how I remember her, always pretty.
Now that I've seen confirmation... I can only say that
"I'm so sorry".

Sept 11 was hard but only because I felt fear & sadness for all those people who perished that day.
And to think that someone I had known perished that day just makes it sadder.

I remember Rosa & her sisters (& brothers) since I was a little girl living in J.C. on North St. We all lived in the same bldg.
But what I mostly remember was that Rosa & Migdalia were inseparable..., as I was with my sisters.

I, too, know what it is to lose a sister..You NEVER forget.

And so, I want to take this opportunity to offer my condolences to the Gonzalez family & to her daughter Jenifer, who has gained an "Angel in Heaven".

May God Bless Rosa always.

October 31, 2006

Kristine

As I cross-stitched your name on the memorial that I am doing for all of the victims, I prayed for you and your family. Please know that your death was not in vain. We will always remember. God Bless.

October 23, 2006

P Tabbernor

In remembrance....

September 11, 2006

N. Del Valle

I would like to say that on this fifth year of this tragedy there is something I thought about doing this morning and that is never going to bed mad and going to sleep or to work without saying I love you to my kids & husband. I can only live for today but I do know that I will make a memory bracelet with your name Rosa, Officer Ramon Suarez, Anthony Alvarado and Waleska Martinez because these names bring me the strength to look past all the little things in life that can bring you down. These names are life to me, they are a constant reminder of how lucky their families were to have them. They are my strength. Rosa, I'll always keep you in my heart friend...



Jennifer, know that she is proud of you.

September 11, 2006

Cindy

Even after 5 years it doesn't get any easier. Maggie, Jeff & Jenn you are always in my thoughts and Rosa is always in my prayers.

September 11, 2005

Cindy Papp

Always in my prayers.

September 11, 2005

Yolanda Morales

My prayers are with you and your family today and always.

August 30, 2005

jennifer hernandez

hi my names jen rosa was my mother she was a very good person i love u and miss u so much we will never forgat u ever

Posted by jennifer hernandez

August 16, 2004

Anna Lee

I first heard of Rosa from an article about Genelle Guzman. I am so sorry about her passing. We are all so shocked and we continue to pray for all those who died on that fateful day. I think of them often and wish that they are at peace and in God's embrace.

September 11, 2003

Cindy

Rosa,



I think of you often, I know you see your daughter from your special place in heaven and you smile with pride. She has become quite a lovely women. On this your second anniversary with God I wish for you and your family peace.

September 10, 2003

eydie boyd

to.rosa

this is your second birthday in heaven.always know you will be

missed by your family and friends.

from:the boyds

December 22, 2002

Cindy

Maggie, Jeff & Jenn



You are always in my thoughts and prayers even more now around the Holidays. May god hold you and keep close.



Cindy

December 17, 2002

eydie garriga

i pray for all of you everyday and for god to give you the strengh to move on.
rosa you and your family will always be in our hearts.

December 6, 2002

christy torres

may god be with your soul.your daughter is growing up beautifully

and i am glad to say that she is my cousin.i am proud of jennifer and she is a very strong girl.she misses you alot and always talks about you.i know you will be waiting for us in heaven.you are the most beautiful angel there will ever be.we miss you.god bless america.i love you jenn.

September 11, 2002

Robin Llabres

On September 9th my family and I walked in a memorial in Bay Ridge, Brooklyn. My 8 yr old daughter proudly held a card bearing your beautiful Susan's name. May God give you strength to get through this very hard time. Susan will never be forgotten

September 11, 2002

Susan LeDee

One year ago today you began your day as always.

One year ago today you went to work to support your family.

One year ago today you lost your life.

And today 9/11/2002 you and everyone else who died at the WTC are my heros!

Your death was not in vain, you have helped unite this nation. You have brought tears to many eyes,you made strangers come together in love, love for you and all of the other heros of 9/11/2001. You have brought people together who would not normally even look at each other in passing. You have helped in the uniting of a nation. In death you have done more then anyone in life. May you rest in eternal peace!



God Bless you Rosa Julia Gonzalez

September 10, 2002

rebecca wittman

The appearance of Ms. Gonalez's name in the beautiful poem written by Billy Collins prompted me to write. I want those who are no longer able to give her a hug to know that she - and they - are embraced in human love, for all time, by the family of man.

Blessings and peace.

September 8, 2002

Rev. Rosa Julia Caraballo

I was moved to respond because my maiden name is also Rosa Julia González,to know that someone with my name died at WTC on 9/11 moved me to tears and this search to see who this woman was.

I am a mother of two adult daughters, one of whom was on her way that morning to her college very near the World Trade Center. As I arrived at the hospital where I work as a chaplain I heard the news of the attack. I didn't cease to try and reach my daughter so that she wouldn't get on the train that morning, she had already been warned by another friend and didn't leave the house.

I can only imagine how Rosa felt that morning and so my prayers are with her daughter and family. Please accept my sincere condolences on your loss.

Sincerely, Rev. Rosa J. Caraballo (González)

September 3, 2002

Veronica Loomis

God Bless the Gonzalez family. My special prayers are with Jennifer.

July 22, 2002

A Friend

In Loving Memory of Rosa Julia Gonzalez



I'd like the memory of me to be a happy one.

I'd like to leave an afterglow of smiles when life is done.

I'd like to leave an echo whispering softly down the ways, of happy times and laughing times and bright and sunny days.

I'd like the tears of those who grieve, to dry before the sun.

Of happy memories that I leave when life is done.

July 21, 2002

Cindy Papp

It has taken me this long to be able to view this site. Rosa, Maggie and I lived in the same building and I still remeber the day I was able to get home and found out Rosa wasn't. Sitting in the apartment with her family, posting pictures, leaving candles and flowers and waiting for any word at all. Although we were not close friends I will always remeber the beautiful pettie woman that Rosa was. I would give anything to be able to call her again to ask her to turn the music down!! Maggie I will always be here for you if you need me for anything.



Love And Friendship always

Cindy

May 20, 2002

tanya

As I was passing through i spotted this beautiful women and wanted to give my deepest sympathy.... may god bless your beautiful soul... May you be God's keeper for eternity... God bless you and your family... r.i.p.

- A SADDENED GIRL IN P.A.

April 7, 2002

Peggy Shearman

I had made a trip to NYC in November, 2001, to try to regain a sense of control in my own life after the 9-11 tragedies. Some people say I was inconsiderate becaue I did take pictures. I took pictures to share, with discretion, with people at home because of the domino effect that these events have had on all of our lives and the awakening of deep compassion that I have found with those who suffer. I came across this particular memorial, of Rosa Julia Gonzalez, and my life was changed.

When I first saw on television the planes hit the WTC towers, and then watched throughout the day and night the many people who were pleading to know where their loved ones were, I could sense their desperate need for hope that they would find them. I just shook my head and my heart ached at their struggle. I don't know if it was because I was watching from a distance and could see the overall devastation that people who were right there could not see. I wanted to ease their suffering, but I knew they had to go through the process themselves of finding the truth of where their loved one was.

When I saw the memoriala, just above the NYC Police Memorial Wall, I felt relief. There were such beautiful expressions of love, suffering and loss. I came across the memorial of Rosa and immediately I connected and my life changed. Her memorial helped me let go of the pain I had within for the many people who had suffered with grief, myself and others....the people who were left behind. That is why I went to MYC.....to recognize those left behind and at many levels of grief. I also found a much deeper compassion for others. Rosa's memorial gave a message that her loved ones were letting go by saying "Rest In Peace. This was a beautiful step in closure and I could finally understand who I was and what I had to do in my own life. Thank you, Rosa and family, and may there be Peace on Earth and in our hearts. Through her life she has given life.

April 5, 2002

Carmen Rodriguez

I would like to express my deepest condolesence to your family. I attended PS 37 about 20yrs ago and Rosa and her sisters attended as well. When I found out about her passing I cried for a week I was very depressed. I work right by the former WTC and that day was the scariest day of my life. Once again my deepest sympathy to the Gonzalez family GOD BLESS YOU.

March 11, 2002

someone who cares new jersey

Dear Rosa & Family,

Even though I did not ever meet you I feel as though I had to write to say how sorry I was to your family. Your beauty will forever shine in your daughter's eyes forever. You will never be forgotten and your life leaves so many loved ones asking why? Only GOD knows that but one thing is sure...I will keep all of you in my prayers and always will remember Rosa Julia Gonzalez, forever.

March 11, 2002

P. Martinez

I met Rosa a couple of years ago when she was working at the Housing Authority. She was always so happy and up-beat, kind and caring. I never knew she passed away until today. My heart goes out to her daughter, I hope she'll always know what a great mother she had. I'm sorry Rosa that your life was cut so short. God Bless You and your family. May you rest in peace.

March 1, 2002

Bernadette Hernandez

Rosa, we met many years ago when Miguel brought Jenny to the house to meet and play with my daughter Amanda. He is her father's best friend. I feel such sorrow for your family, especially for Jenny. My heart goes out to her. I pray that you are resting peacefully in heaven with all of God's angels. Take comfort in knowing that your daughter will be taken care of and that she will never forget the wonderful mother that she had in you. God bless you mamita.

January 26, 2002

DEAR GOD SHINE YOUR LIGHT ON THIS

WOMAN ROSA J.GONZALEZ AND MAY HER SOUL REST IN PEACE WITH GOD AND HIS

ANGELS..GOD BLESS HER FAMILY AND FRIENDS .GOD BLESS AMERICA AND MAY WE NEVER FORGET 9/11/01..MAY SHE

PICK ROSES IN HEAVEN TODAY...AMEN

January 21, 2002

Katrina Ahart

I have the memorial bracelet with Rosa's name on it and will wear it until this war on terrorism at last ends. I grieve for your family's loss.

January 14, 2002

Joanne LoBello

Rosa,



May you rest in peace. My thoughts and prayers are with you and your family.

December 30, 2001

Teresa Jahn

America Cries

We see your sorrow-

and our hearts cry....

We can not erase your pain

but you do not have to face the anguish alone-for we-

-the American people-

are beside you.

We so desperately want to have the touch that brings you comfort,

the strength that gives you courage,

and the words to lighten your spirits.

And when we are left speechless

may the silence of our nation weave love into your hearts

to ease your sorrow.

May you find healing through our nation's strength as we-

-the American people-

face this difficult time together. Our hearts are with you. Teresa Jahn

Dixon, IL

December 4, 2001

Yolanda Morales

To The family,

I have known some of your family members for a while but did not know that Rosa worked in the WTC. I found out on Sunday that Rosa had passed way because your wife told my motjer. I am sorr for your loss and hope that God gives you the strength to carry on to help raise her daughter. I was there that day and I can honestly say that to tjis day I stil feel guilty for making it out when so many people I knew didn't.

November 13, 2001

jeffrey coleman

Rosa is my sister in law, my wife's sister. My wife and Rosa's daughter, Jennifer, still to this day cannot except that Rosa has been taken from us. Jennifer now lives with me and my wife. I have read so many tributes to the wonderful people that we have lost at the WTC and I just want to say that Rosa was also a beautiful and caring person that certainly did not deserve to die in this way. I fear that we have all lost some of the greatest, warm, and loving people in the WTC and I mourn with all the families of all the other victims. I know the families of the victims will never forget about this brutality but I pray that the rest of the world will not either. Rosa was a single mother that really making an effort to better herself and give her daughter the best upbringing possible. Her job with the Port Authority was another step towards success. My wife and I were so proud of the her accomplishments. It is devastating to see her life cut so short. Our mission now is to care for her daughter and to do the best we can to make her a success to in spite of this tragedy in her life.

Rosa, we will never forget you and we will always miss you everyday for the rest of our lives.

October 24, 2001

Diana Santiago

My deepest condolences to the family. I don't know if I knew Sandra in school, but I was from Jersey City and saw her name and age and where she was from and my heart went out to her and her family. God Bless you Sandra and rest in peace!

October 19, 2001

Kindra Robinson

I will keep you and your family in prayer.

October 6, 2001

Denise Hinson

My deepest condolences go out to Rosa's family. May God guide you thru this difficult time and may you know you are in many peoples thoughts. God Bless

October 1, 2001

AnnaMarie Baker

I am so sorry for your loss of life, I know that you were loved on here on earth. My Prayers go out to your family and friends. I know that you were a very special person. I do not even know you, but you were somebody and you still are. You are one amongst many angels looking down on us right now. Peace be with You!!

September 29, 2001

Jodi Valdez

I just picked this name at random, among thousands to choose from. I am far away from NYC, but have been affected tremendously by the loss of life. I am so sorry for everyone. I cry everyday as I hear individual stories of people who lost their loved ones. I can only hope and pray that all these innocent people are in a better place than here - if this were true, this wouldn't be such a tragedy. To Rosa Gonzalez - I'm very very sorry that your life had to end so young. If you had children, may God Bless them.

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